@evan eww. people are really fond of the worst option, huh?
sports champion is probably pretty unhealthy unless it's a mental sport maybe.
CEO makes you a state-capitalist crony and boss, which is morally corrupting, but probably not nearly as much as 'politician'.
superstar entertainer, may not be that great mentally, but given the money, i think they have a fair bit of choice what they'll get involved with 🤷.
I really don't get people expecting their child to be a political leader. You get the bad exposure without the money.
@evan For my children, I would generally favor CEO, simply because it would (in most cases) be easier for them to lead normal lives if they quit.
Do I think they would/could make great impact in another of these roles... absolutely. But I'm wary of the toll that power takes on a personal life.
IAC, while I may favor one role, they are free to choose another.
I picked entertainer mostly because, of these four, it's the most likely for my kids.
But not that likely. At least not at the "superstar" level.
@evan These all are roles with power, but different tools for exercising it. Bigco CEOs have the best chance for outsized impact in the short to medium term, national/regional politicians in the longer term (but less likely), and inspiring others (arts, sports) can endure for generations but your chances are slim to have that impact.
Wonderful discussion; thanks so much to everyone who responded.
It feels like there's a balance that has to be met for all these roles: the intrinsic rewards (satisfaction), the extrinsic ones (power, money), the personal harm (emotional, physical) and the chance to make meaningful change in the world.
There's also the question of what we want for our children: the agency to choose their own path, but also the chance for a fulfilling and meaningful life, and a minimization of danger, temptation to do evil.
These are only a few of the paths a person can take in life, although in our culture they're usually considered a path to "success." Some people were pretty enthusiastic about them; others though the harms of these roles vastly outweighed any benefits.
Of the four, I think the life of an artist is one that can have huge impact on others and be satisfying and enjoyable. Unfortunately the chances of becoming a "superstar" are low, but a life creating art can be rewarding in many other ways. It takes a lot of personal discipline to avoid the downfalls of fame though. I think both my kids have creative minds and big personalities, so I think this one would be my choice.
@evan I missed this when it came around but as someone who grew up with two exceptional/successful (in their own individual ways) parents who were also.. a little wrapped up in their own achievements, I think were I to consider what I'd want for a possible child, I'd look for kindness and contentedness over nearly anything else. My partner is both kind and content and it's about the best life you can imagine in a lot of ways (I like my life too and I am kind but I am rarely content)
@jessamyn thanks! I was trying to stick with some high-intensity roles that are traditionally considered successful even though they have major downsides.
@evan I put CEO. My dad was a CEO so it's what I know. Through his work he was able to bring joy and meaning to many lives. He wasn't corrupted by his position. He was loved by his colleagues. He was granted an honorary doctorate for his work which, as a kid who was expelled from school, was a great honour for him. We lived comfortably (but not extravagantly). He was able to retire quite early to pursue his passion for natural history. My childhood was one of happiness and I am a proud son.
@evan omg, none! Those all sound like curses to me.
@gargantua pick the least bad one.
@evan athlete, with fingers crossed that it would be badminton
@evan great scientist
@evan none of these just being happy
@evan I answered "political leader" but would qualify that as "movement activist" not "say anything to get power" (hypothetical, I don't have children)
@evan I feel like CEO of a company would be least risky. As an American, I feel like people who are visible in the public eye (politician, superstar) are more likely to be targets of violence. And athletic careers have an expiration date. Being CEO of a small company is hard, but a mid-sized company? They would have a pretty good income, more privacy than the others, and they can transfer those skills to other jobs and companies.
@evan I don't care what my kids do. All I want is for them to be happy.
@benpocalypse which would make them the most happy?
@evan None of those paths lead to happiness directly. I just want them to find their own gratitude in whatever they chose in life. My older brother is a welder, which from the outside is shitty manual labor, but he's completely happy with his life. That's all I want for my kids.
@evan went with sports because while I'd enjoy my hypothetical child to be a left wing political leader, I would not want them to be a right wing political leader.
@stinerman that one's a real roll of the dice, I agree.
@evan I mostly enjoy your polls and do my best to enjoy them as thought provocations rather than as pedentry provocations.
Anyway, curious whether anyone has attempted to characterize differences in outcomes across these four, with caveat that it'd be hard to calibrate "levels" across them.
ps I chose CEO for my hypothetical child as I imagine this path would impose the least obligation on me. Perhaps this kind of thinking is why such child is hypothetical only!
@mlinksva thanks!
Are you asking why the numbers are different between the four options?
Yes, seeking minimum obligation is not often compatible with child-rearing.
@evan wasn't really my intention to look for an explanation of the poll results (why the numbers are different) but perhaps subconciously I was -- I suppose they embed people's estimations of various life outcomes associated with each of the four paths. This is what I mean by your polls often being thought provoking. :)
@mlinksva I mean, that's usually the intention. Sometimes I really want to find out how popular something is. Most of the time I'm hoping to spark thought and conversation.
@evan I've heard that successful musicians are among the happiest in their jobs, so I went with "entertainer".
@evan none.
@evan My initial reaction was revulsion at all of the options, which says much more about how I feel about current political leaders than it does about my child.
Then I remembered that one of the problems with political leaders is that the worst examples are drawn to the position for the wrong reasons, and that what we need are people who genuinely want to find the best solutions.
On reflection, my child could be one of the good ones. Thus my choice.
@dbs good choice!
@evan of the choices, I think my child would face the least unhappiness as a sportsperson.
@evan I said CEO, not because I'd want them to climb a corporate ladder, but because if they get into #entrepreneurship, which is a creative endeavor, and they're successful at it, then that's where they'll end up.
Superstar entertainer would have been my second choice.
@evan both political leader and CEO involve being constantly immersed in the worst aspects of humanity. Sports champion would be way too single-minded and grueling for my kid. She likes art and music, and entertainers at least get to express themselves and probably have some relaxing time between projects.
@evan None?...
@elduvelle no
@evan lolwhat, people want their kids to be politicians!? I picked "entertainer" - at least they reach people...
I went with sports, because at least they are getting exercise. Entertaining comes with stalkers, CEOs are usually evil, same with most politicians.
@evan Fame is unhealthy for most people. Thus of the four options I have picked the one least likely to make my child famous: CEO.
@evan I would love my little cousins to be sports champions, hoping they would value fair play and hard work. They would have some sort of education too because sport careers end when people are still young.
@evan I choose political leader, in hope that the values In instilling in her would make her a force for good.
@evan Skipping the question this time as I want for my offspring whatever makes them most fulfilled.
I don't see INFLUENCER SPREADING RUSSIAN PROPAGANDA FOR $100,000 PER VIDEO on this list....
@evan
👍 👍
Whatever makes them feel good, purposeful, happy, and/or self-worth.
@Marrekoo which of these four professions do you think is most likely to make them feel good, purposeful, happy, and worthy?
That woild be up to them. How can I decide what they aspire?
@Marrekoo don't worry, it's a non-binding poll.
This is a choice out of the four options. I'm aware that there are other career paths and I did not "forget" them. Please choose one of these four.
If you don't have children, you can answer for an imagined or hypothetical child, or for a child of your family or friends, or you can just skip the question.
I realize that these are common sense, but I get so, so, so many replies from people along these lines. I assume at least some of them are good faith; another segment are trying to be funny; and a final segment just want to play "gotcha" with every single post on the Fediverse.
I really enjoy when people share their thought process with me as they go through my polls. The threads can be really fun. But just having reply after reply telling me how wrong I am and how bad it is to post questions I think are fun and interesting really wears me down.
I've already gotten a lot of responses along the lines of "whatever they want" or "whatever makes them happy".
That's an admirable rubric for making a decision.
Now, look at the list and pick the one that you think is most likely for them to want or to make them happy.
@evan Your current situation reminded me of
@evan I love your polls and appreciate the effort you put into them!!
@evan I was actually thinking of this earlier today. There are times I wish there was a Dark Evan polls. Something that forced us to examine our inner Dexter. But I came to the conclusion I like the fun and interesting polls and how they allow us to think without sinking into the doom scrolling that can be social media. I really appreciate these.
@evan hahaha
Of these four achievements, which would you want most for your child?
#EvanPoll #poll
Political leader 44% (159 votes)
CEO of a big company 19% (68 votes)
Superstar entertainer you voted for this answer 18% (65 votes)
Sports champion 17% (64 votes)